The Very Safe and Effective Vaccine

@cd329

 Now to school you...

this thread just got good

battle of the royale wit cheese

@cd329

 Now to school you, because if there's one thing I hate, it's clearly ignorant, clearly uneducated people throwing around insults like "dumbass". There's so much to unpack here. Where do I start?

First of all, let's define what it means to catch a virus. We're surrounded by viral pathogens, virons, at all times. They're always around us, on us, in us. There's a good chance that you and/or have influenza, or say, covid virons on us, in our respiratory systems, as I type this. Usually when someone catches the flu, or catches covid, or catches a rhinovirus based common cold, what it means is that the body has allowed the virus to replicate unchecked to the point of becoming symptomatic. You are now sick. Many of those symptoms are your bodies response to an invader. A stuffy/runny nose is to block, and flush out the sinus cavity. A fever is the body raising it's core temperature in an attempt to burn the virus out. The body also creates antibodies.

A vaccine introduces a small amount of a sterile version of a virus, or some representation/facsimile of said virus, into the body in the hopes that it will prepare the body to create antibodies to combat said virus. With the Johnson and Johnson vaccines, a different virus was dressed up as covid. With the mRNA vaccines, the body was hacked to create it's own spike proteins that mimic the spiked invader corona virons. This was the genius but quite possibly also the folly. With the early versions of covid 19, hospitalization and death rates were so high that yes, scientist were just hoping for a fighting chance. Hoping to keep people out of ERs. However, the goal of most vaccines is that your body is able to recognize the invader, and defeat it, before you ever get sick. Nobody ever gets a flu shot thinking, "I hope if I get the flu, i'm not hospitalized," because the average person, at least moderately healthy, isn't going to the doctor, and definitely is being admitted to the hospital, for the flu. You get flu shots in the hope that you don't get sick at all.

Every immunes system is different. I don't think I have ever had a flu shot, and I never get the flu. And I spent a couple decades partying, drinking, sharing joints with complete strangers, hooking up with random chicks, and abusing cocaine, etc. We could get into the yrue efficacy of the vaccines, and herd immunity, which I think is the true hero of the pandemic but I believe it would fall on deaf ears. For the record, i'm not a "maga". I'm not anti-vaccination. And I was way heavy into reading about mRNA therapies before covid even happened. So i'm not anti-mRNA. That system of vaccination is highly experimental though. And I respect any taking a stance of skepticism.

Trump boasted about HIS covid-19 vaccines:

¡°I handed the new administration what everyone
is now calling a modern-day medical miracle!¡±
                               - Trump said in February 2021.
¡°Some say it¡¯s the greatest thing to happen in hundreds of years!¡±

People are on the fence about mRNA now but in 50 years, when mRNA and CRISPR based therapies are the norm, we will look back at some current therapies in the same way we look at lobotomies, or the use of leaches for blood letting. Completely archaic.

@cd329

 Imagine going to bed every night believing your brother died for lack of a vaccine and not because of his own weak immune system. 

Imagine wishing death on me because I simply disagreed with you, and not in a combative way.

moved to the box

I liked the debate....thought it was refreshing....

nalgas (_Y_)

Yes it was refreshing! There was no reason at all to move this thread!

According to Healio, latest covid vaccines reduce hospitalization risk by 50%.  This season's influenza vaccines are similarly protective.  Overall, vaccinations are the most cost effective public health intervention against infectious diseases known to mankind.  Still saving millions of lives in the US.

Very few people are hospitalized because of covid these days, bro. Vaccinated or not.

Ridiculous to the point of absurd ¡­..that we¡¯re in the predicament of listening to these slick tricksters and having to be annoyed by a third ¡­..of the population¡­..whose job is to drop dollops of nonchalant godly misinformation ¡­¡­but fuck that , cuz you know imma star ¡­..so of course I¡¯ll get to the key ¡­..like Francis Scott for the free , only I¡¯m spock the monster unlocked , mocker of the dishonest and the comical hypocrisy¡­¡­.

@StumpTownStu

 Zackly...that vaccination didn't do shit and they have zero proof to support it....it was used as a go to identifier that it helped get us out of the pandemic...

Even the guinea pigs were like....

I would like someone to convince me how the previous pandemic took 2 years to get out of when there was less means of traveling and no medicine to combat it, yet the most recent pandemic took the same amount of time to get out of with widespread world travel but better advancement in medicine.....something doesn't add up to me if you compare the two pandemics...shouldn't it have taken longer for us to get out of the most recent pandemic given the circumstances of very widespread travel...

And this was true until many were forced to take it.

So let us drill down on this subject;

The original vaccine was designed for the original COVID-19. The vast majority of deaths were those 65 and older and those with comorbidities. For those people taking a fast tracked vaccine was the best option. For the rest of the population it should have been a personal choice but for many it was not, they lost their jobs or were kicked out of schools.

Iceland reported that every 4th generation of COVID contained changes to it's dna makeup. It mutated often and when it mutated into Delta variant in India, December of 2020, it got around the vaccine designed for original COVID-19. It was, in esense a new virus and it swept across Europe. It was first detected in the U.S. in May of 2021 in Texas, a border state. As the UK was telling the world that 40% of their hospitalizations were the fully vaccinated Biden was telling the United States you will not even get COVID let alone go to the hospital or die. 

The state of Minnesota was one of a few that tracked unvaxed deaths vs vaccinated COVID deaths. From May 2, 2021 to April 10th, 2022 they had 2,837 unvaccinated deaths and 2,013 vaccinated deaths. 19,137 unvaxed hospitalizations and 10,856 vaccinated hospitalizations. During that period the state's population went from 44% vaxed to 77% vaxed. So yes the vaccine saved some lives yet for many it did not matter. 

So how many fully vaccinated died from COVID and it's variants in the US? Why is that information not readily available? It should be. 

The numbers/stats kept are atrocious...they got this shit wrong from the beginning and it spiraled from there...when deaths were recorded as COVID deaths just because someone simply had COVID when it may not have been the cause of death then you knew that we were in trouble statistically....many many deaths were recorded in just that fashion without indicating the underlying cause of the death...no different if one died of the flu versus it being for another reason and just because they had the flu it is recorded as a flu related death...that would be wrong recordkeeping altogether...

And one must ask yourself how many recorded related positive COVID cases were counted multiple times simply because a person who was already infected and tested positive kept retesting and testing positive???? These were not counted as the same reoccurring case but rather as new cases...that also is atrocious recordkeeping and simply not accurate...

COVID was botched every which way from a records standpoint

@ABooksNightmare

 The covid record keeping stats were more horrific then BCs record keeping 

spot on

I almost spit out beer when I read this one

More should be dying from getting jab, no?  

Sorry dr dickhead, he was in good shape.  People like you are the scum of the earth

I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who regrets not getting the jab.

Plenty who regret getting it though.

No he wasn't. Let's dive deeper into this. According to you, your entire family got the vaccine, he didn't. He subsequently died from covid. As Uniman touched on in post #138, by the time the vaccine hit the streets, the virus had already mutated multiple times. The dominant variants were significantly less fatal. If "healthy" people weren't really dying of covid to begin with, they definitely weren't dying from Delta, Omicron, or all of it's offshoots. Literally everyone I know has have covid. Most multiple times. If you're brother died from it, it wasn't for lack of a vaccine. It was him.

None of this is neither here nor there. You wished death on me because I disagreed with you. I wasn't nasty. I wasn't combative. You say shit like that all the time to people and it's just swept under the rug. This time you were dumb enough to mention your dead brother. I promise you I will never forget you wishing death on me, or your weak brother being taken out by a common cold.

@cd329

 Covid turned your brother into a pack. 

Who's got rolling papers?

Stu...can we discuss changing your Avatar to another player...I identify you more as a strong safety or free safety for some reason...I'd like to see a number change if at all possible but I just can't put my finger on which number yet....I just see you leading the COVERS league in interceptions and maybe even fumble recoveries....we're talking hall of fame numbers here....let me know and we can discuss further after you are done debating with the guy who wished death upon you...

godspeed

Stu is very articulate ...and has a huge heater