A deck of 52 cards can be shuffled in 52! ways. 52! is about 2^225 (to be precise, 80,658,175,170,943,878,571,660,636,856,404,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, 000,000,000 ways). We use 249 random bits from both entropy sources (user input and quantum randomness) to achieve an even and unpredictable statistical distribution.
So what's more likely? that they follow the law, or that they've come up with schemes to manipulate 80 gagagagagaagagagagagilzillion different shuffle possibilities to make you and some other people lose some of the time, but then win some of the time, and then have donks win some of the time, but then make them lose later, so that they can get a couple more cents per year, all the while risking their entire company while they are being monitored by Cigital and the like?
A deck of 52 cards can be shuffled in 52! ways. 52! is about 2^225 (to be precise, 80,658,175,170,943,878,571,660,636,856,404,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, 000,000,000 ways). We use 249 random bits from both entropy sources (user input and quantum randomness) to achieve an even and unpredictable statistical distribution.
So what's more likely? that they follow the law, or that they've come up with schemes to manipulate 80 gagagagagaagagagagagilzillion different shuffle possibilities to make you and some other people lose some of the time, but then win some of the time, and then have donks win some of the time, but then make them lose later, so that they can get a couple more cents per year, all the while risking their entire company while they are being monitored by Cigital and the like?
so what's more logical? they follow this code or they risk everything for a couple extra cents by targeting good live players by making them lose more often online?
so what's more logical? they follow this code or they risk everything for a couple extra cents by targeting good live players by making them lose more often online?
Its more likely that they break the law and come up with schemes than not. Im not kidding. They say that shit, but who audits them, who verifies this info? Not a third party. Look, I didn't say ALL sites are heavily influenced, perhaps your lucky and you get a fair site with pokerstars or fulltilt, but Party Poker from my experience is manipulated. What do you expect, they'll tell you what you want to hear, can anyone really dispute their claims without evidence, no.
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Its more likely that they break the law and come up with schemes than not. Im not kidding. They say that shit, but who audits them, who verifies this info? Not a third party. Look, I didn't say ALL sites are heavily influenced, perhaps your lucky and you get a fair site with pokerstars or fulltilt, but Party Poker from my experience is manipulated. What do you expect, they'll tell you what you want to hear, can anyone really dispute their claims without evidence, no.
Its more likely that they break the law and come up with schemes than not. Im not kidding. They say that shit, but who audits them, who verifies this info? Not a third party. Look, I didn't say ALL sites are heavily influenced, perhaps your lucky and you get a fair site with pokerstars or fulltilt, but Party Poker from my experience is manipulated. What do you expect, they'll tell you what you want to hear, can anyone really dispute their claims without evidence, no.
so you really wont tell us your screenname?
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
Its more likely that they break the law and come up with schemes than not. Im not kidding. They say that shit, but who audits them, who verifies this info? Not a third party. Look, I didn't say ALL sites are heavily influenced, perhaps your lucky and you get a fair site with pokerstars or fulltilt, but Party Poker from my experience is manipulated. What do you expect, they'll tell you what you want to hear, can anyone really dispute their claims without evidence, no.
I wont tell YOU my screeenname, Your the only idiot that thinks their is a correlation. Ive shared my stats with others before, I dont care. But Im not an idiot. Maybe when you can make a valid point, Ill give it to you
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I wont tell YOU my screeenname, Your the only idiot that thinks their is a correlation. Ive shared my stats with others before, I dont care. But Im not an idiot. Maybe when you can make a valid point, Ill give it to you
I wont tell YOU my screeenname, Your the only idiot that thinks their is a correlation. Ive shared my stats with others before, I dont care. But Im not an idiot. Maybe when you can make a valid point, Ill give it to you
Right on. So youre just another losing player blaming the site. Yet Im the moron cuz I win online and dont believe your fairy tales. Yet youre a genius cuz you lose money online and cry rigged
Sounds good to me bud!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
I wont tell YOU my screeenname, Your the only idiot that thinks their is a correlation. Ive shared my stats with others before, I dont care. But Im not an idiot. Maybe when you can make a valid point, Ill give it to you
Right on. So youre just another losing player blaming the site. Yet Im the moron cuz I win online and dont believe your fairy tales. Yet youre a genius cuz you lose money online and cry rigged
Its more likely that they break the law and come up with schemes than not. Im not kidding. They say that shit, but who audits them, who verifies this info? Not a third party. Look, I didn't say ALL sites are heavily influenced, perhaps your lucky and you get a fair site with pokerstars or fulltilt, but Party Poker from my experience is manipulated. What do you expect, they'll tell you what you want to hear, can anyone really dispute their claims without evidence, no.
So what's the point of them breaking the law again?
Is it to make a little more money?
how do they do that again?
by manipulating hands so that good players lose and bad players win?
and how do they decide what a good player is?
I'm really honestly trying to understand your logic. explain to me how they make more money, illegally, by manipulating 80 gagillion levels of random numbers.
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
Its more likely that they break the law and come up with schemes than not. Im not kidding. They say that shit, but who audits them, who verifies this info? Not a third party. Look, I didn't say ALL sites are heavily influenced, perhaps your lucky and you get a fair site with pokerstars or fulltilt, but Party Poker from my experience is manipulated. What do you expect, they'll tell you what you want to hear, can anyone really dispute their claims without evidence, no.
So what's the point of them breaking the law again?
Is it to make a little more money?
how do they do that again?
by manipulating hands so that good players lose and bad players win?
and how do they decide what a good player is?
I'm really honestly trying to understand your logic. explain to me how they make more money, illegally, by manipulating 80 gagillion levels of random numbers.
Ive already explained it Gunners, look back. Its not easy to believe when one wants to strongly believe everything in the contrary. Look at other debates, get your own info. Im done
Please don't listen me, because I don;t care. Those who know, know.
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Ive already explained it Gunners, look back. Its not easy to believe when one wants to strongly believe everything in the contrary. Look at other debates, get your own info. Im done
Please don't listen me, because I don;t care. Those who know, know.
Maybe when you can make a valid point, Ill give it to you
When were these valid point(s) you made???
Was it when you said the shuffles arent fair but then had no data proving it?
Or was it when you talked about the cash out curse but have no experience or anything to back up that claim?
Was it when you said youre a good player but wont provide any of your online results?
Was it when you said "there are just times when a bad beat is programmed to happen" but couldnt describe when exactly those times are other than, "you know it happens?"
Or was it when you talked about how when on different sites at the same time that the same cards are coming up on both screens>>
Youre right dude Im sorry. I just cannot keep up with all these "valid" points youre making. You should have been on the debate team, youre really good at this
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
Maybe when you can make a valid point, Ill give it to you
When were these valid point(s) you made???
Was it when you said the shuffles arent fair but then had no data proving it?
Or was it when you talked about the cash out curse but have no experience or anything to back up that claim?
Was it when you said youre a good player but wont provide any of your online results?
Was it when you said "there are just times when a bad beat is programmed to happen" but couldnt describe when exactly those times are other than, "you know it happens?"
Or was it when you talked about how when on different sites at the same time that the same cards are coming up on both screens>>
Youre right dude Im sorry. I just cannot keep up with all these "valid" points youre making. You should have been on the debate team, youre really good at this
Ive already explained it Gunners, look back. Its not easy to believe when one wants to strongly believe everything in the contrary. Look at other debates, get your own info. Im done
Please don't listen me, because I don;t care. Those who know, know.
That "info" you provided was so awesome too!!!
Wasnt your info "I just know??"
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
Ive already explained it Gunners, look back. Its not easy to believe when one wants to strongly believe everything in the contrary. Look at other debates, get your own info. Im done
Please don't listen me, because I don;t care. Those who know, know.
Was it when you said the shuffles arent fair but then had no data proving it?
Or was it when you talked about the cash out curse but have no experience or anything to back up that claim?
Was it when you said youre a good player but wont provide any of your online results?
Was it when you said "there are just times when a bad beat is programmed to happen" but couldnt describe when exactly those times are other than, "you know it happens?"
Or was it when you talked about how when on different sites at the same time that the same cards are coming up on both screens>>
Youre right dude Im sorry. I just cannot keep up with all these "valid" points youre making. You should have been on the debate team, youre really good at this
I have all the experience in all those aspects. Its meaningless to provide specific examples. Oh, I lost with AA 3 straight times, or I lost this way. That doesn't say shit. This is my experience over several years online and off. Not just my personal experience. Since there is no proof out there at the moment, you must be right about everything, lets debunk all other theories because theres no real proof. Ya okay, open your imagination both of you, greed runs rampant in all companies, but the poker sites are all angels, they have to be, right? Like I said, Im done
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Quote Originally Posted by electricladylnd:
When were these valid point(s) you made???
Was it when you said the shuffles arent fair but then had no data proving it?
Or was it when you talked about the cash out curse but have no experience or anything to back up that claim?
Was it when you said youre a good player but wont provide any of your online results?
Was it when you said "there are just times when a bad beat is programmed to happen" but couldnt describe when exactly those times are other than, "you know it happens?"
Or was it when you talked about how when on different sites at the same time that the same cards are coming up on both screens>>
Youre right dude Im sorry. I just cannot keep up with all these "valid" points youre making. You should have been on the debate team, youre really good at this
I have all the experience in all those aspects. Its meaningless to provide specific examples. Oh, I lost with AA 3 straight times, or I lost this way. That doesn't say shit. This is my experience over several years online and off. Not just my personal experience. Since there is no proof out there at the moment, you must be right about everything, lets debunk all other theories because theres no real proof. Ya okay, open your imagination both of you, greed runs rampant in all companies, but the poker sites are all angels, they have to be, right? Like I said, Im done
Ive already explained it Gunners, look back. Its not easy to believe when one wants to strongly believe everything in the contrary. Look at other debates, get your own info. Im done
Please don't listen me, because I don;t care. Those who know, know.
Ok, i looke back and still don't understand some things. you said this: "Dude, Ill give you articles, there have been known instances on major poker sites, super user accounts for example, all kinds of manipulative shit and you sit there and try to bring the story on me and make it about me. "
I'll take a look at those articles, i'm curious. post the links here or pm me. If you have valid points hidden in there, i'd honestly like to know. just in case i'm wrong and you're right, i don't want to be the victim of online poker manipulation. but i have no reason to believe i am.
What i'm still curious about is: how do they decide who to make lose and who to make win? because i want to be a "make win" guy.
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
Ive already explained it Gunners, look back. Its not easy to believe when one wants to strongly believe everything in the contrary. Look at other debates, get your own info. Im done
Please don't listen me, because I don;t care. Those who know, know.
Ok, i looke back and still don't understand some things. you said this: "Dude, Ill give you articles, there have been known instances on major poker sites, super user accounts for example, all kinds of manipulative shit and you sit there and try to bring the story on me and make it about me. "
I'll take a look at those articles, i'm curious. post the links here or pm me. If you have valid points hidden in there, i'd honestly like to know. just in case i'm wrong and you're right, i don't want to be the victim of online poker manipulation. but i have no reason to believe i am.
What i'm still curious about is: how do they decide who to make lose and who to make win? because i want to be a "make win" guy.
I have all the experience in all those aspects. Its meaningless to provide specific examples. Oh, I lost with AA 3 straight times, or I lost this way. That doesn't say shit. This is my experience over several years online and off. Not just my personal experience. Since there is no proof out there at the moment, you must be right about everything, lets debunk all other theories because theres no real proof. Ya okay, open your imagination both of you, greed runs rampant in all companies, but the poker sites are all angels, they have to be, right? Like I said, Im done
But the thing is this all so easy to prove if theyre doing what you say. Every single hand is recorded but thats where youre theories fall short. There are millions upon millions of hands tracked by PERSONAL tracking software, not the site telling you its ok. All these people have seen nothing.
You talk about your experience online but then you wont even post a simple screenname to even prove that you have experience. Kinda like if you talked about how you were a "professor at a major college" so you can speak on this better than me but then never telling anyone where you worked. You rip me for my supposedly clueless opinions but all youre giving here is your opinion too yet you seem to think that should be enough.
Like I said pages ago, Id love to see you go up to Phil Ivey or Tom Dwan (any pro you respect) and tell them all this. But Im sure after they laugh in your face you'll have some other excuse as to why they did like "oh the sites are paying them off"
I could sum up all your posts in this thread in just a few words ; SHITTY PLAYER CRYING RIGGED
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Quote Originally Posted by MajaWaja:
I have all the experience in all those aspects. Its meaningless to provide specific examples. Oh, I lost with AA 3 straight times, or I lost this way. That doesn't say shit. This is my experience over several years online and off. Not just my personal experience. Since there is no proof out there at the moment, you must be right about everything, lets debunk all other theories because theres no real proof. Ya okay, open your imagination both of you, greed runs rampant in all companies, but the poker sites are all angels, they have to be, right? Like I said, Im done
But the thing is this all so easy to prove if theyre doing what you say. Every single hand is recorded but thats where youre theories fall short. There are millions upon millions of hands tracked by PERSONAL tracking software, not the site telling you its ok. All these people have seen nothing.
You talk about your experience online but then you wont even post a simple screenname to even prove that you have experience. Kinda like if you talked about how you were a "professor at a major college" so you can speak on this better than me but then never telling anyone where you worked. You rip me for my supposedly clueless opinions but all youre giving here is your opinion too yet you seem to think that should be enough.
Like I said pages ago, Id love to see you go up to Phil Ivey or Tom Dwan (any pro you respect) and tell them all this. But Im sure after they laugh in your face you'll have some other excuse as to why they did like "oh the sites are paying them off"
I could sum up all your posts in this thread in just a few words ; SHITTY PLAYER CRYING RIGGED
Ya because I know the exact algorithm, I know all the formulas they use. Cmon, if I figured the way they program everything, Id be taking advantage of it. There's obviously benefits to certain individuals winning during certain sessions. That point is common sense
Again, I never said Im a 'make this guy lose' guy. Ive prob benefited from it and have prob been effected by it. I still haven't complained about shit, but it is present in the industry, to some degree.
Look Ive read some good articles over time. I dont have time now to search for the specific links right now but ill try my best to post a few useful links later today or something. All i wanted to say, was keep an eye open, just because it hasn't been proven, doesn't mean your games are not manipulated at all. i did read fulltilt and pokerstars are among the best in credibility, so perhaps u havent experienced any irregular activity in your eyes but you have to at least be open to the fact that other poker sites may be cheating or rigging their services for other players
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Ya because I know the exact algorithm, I know all the formulas they use. Cmon, if I figured the way they program everything, Id be taking advantage of it. There's obviously benefits to certain individuals winning during certain sessions. That point is common sense
Again, I never said Im a 'make this guy lose' guy. Ive prob benefited from it and have prob been effected by it. I still haven't complained about shit, but it is present in the industry, to some degree.
Look Ive read some good articles over time. I dont have time now to search for the specific links right now but ill try my best to post a few useful links later today or something. All i wanted to say, was keep an eye open, just because it hasn't been proven, doesn't mean your games are not manipulated at all. i did read fulltilt and pokerstars are among the best in credibility, so perhaps u havent experienced any irregular activity in your eyes but you have to at least be open to the fact that other poker sites may be cheating or rigging their services for other players
Anyway electric I will agree with you on Pokerstars-FullTilt-Partypoker is not ripping off their customers they make too much money but Absolute and Ultimate Bet GUILTY or is that a conspiracy theory in your mind.
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Anyway electric I will agree with you on Pokerstars-FullTilt-Partypoker is not ripping off their customers they make too much money but Absolute and Ultimate Bet GUILTY or is that a conspiracy theory in your mind.
Anyway electric I will agree with you on Pokerstars-FullTilt-Partypoker is not ripping off their customers they make too much money but Absolute and Ultimate Bet GUILTY or is that a conspiracy theory in your mind.
Let these guys express their opinions keep your panties on you carry on
worse than a women.
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Quote Originally Posted by gers:
Anyway electric I will agree with you on Pokerstars-FullTilt-Partypoker is not ripping off their customers they make too much money but Absolute and Ultimate Bet GUILTY or is that a conspiracy theory in your mind.
Let these guys express their opinions keep your panties on you carry on
worse than a women.
I think there are without a doubt legit sites out there, but some of these lower level ones, you never know.
All it would take is one or 2 employees to blow the whistle if there was some type of fix going on and they could lose big business, so I would imagine that they wouldn't take that risk.
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I think there are without a doubt legit sites out there, but some of these lower level ones, you never know.
All it would take is one or 2 employees to blow the whistle if there was some type of fix going on and they could lose big business, so I would imagine that they wouldn't take that risk.
A deck of 52 cards can be shuffled in 52! ways. 52! is about 2^225 (to be precise, 80,658,175,170,943,878,571,660,636,856,404,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, 000,000,000 ways). We use 249 random bits from both entropy sources (user input and quantum randomness) to achieve an even and unpredictable statistical distribution.
So what's more likely? that they follow the law, or that they've come up with schemes to manipulate 80 gagagagagaagagagagagilzillion different shuffle possibilities to make you and some other people lose some of the time, but then win some of the time, and then have donks win some of the time, but then make them lose later, so that they can get a couple more cents per year, all the while risking their entire company while they are being monitored by Cigital and the like?
WE use 249 random bits.WE. why dont you get your online site promoting ass off of here with your bullshit lies about how legit the rigged garbage is. really pisses you off when the majority of users realize that there is nothing random about the way the cards come down. unless you are going to be honest and confess to the way the software is really programmed, get the fuc out!
A deck of 52 cards can be shuffled in 52! ways. 52! is about 2^225 (to be precise, 80,658,175,170,943,878,571,660,636,856,404,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, 000,000,000 ways). We use 249 random bits from both entropy sources (user input and quantum randomness) to achieve an even and unpredictable statistical distribution.
So what's more likely? that they follow the law, or that they've come up with schemes to manipulate 80 gagagagagaagagagagagilzillion different shuffle possibilities to make you and some other people lose some of the time, but then win some of the time, and then have donks win some of the time, but then make them lose later, so that they can get a couple more cents per year, all the while risking their entire company while they are being monitored by Cigital and the like?
WE use 249 random bits.WE. why dont you get your online site promoting ass off of here with your bullshit lies about how legit the rigged garbage is. really pisses you off when the majority of users realize that there is nothing random about the way the cards come down. unless you are going to be honest and confess to the way the software is really programmed, get the fuc out!
WE use 249 random bits.WE. why dont you get your online site promoting ass off of here with your bullshit lies about how legit the rigged garbage is. really pisses you off when the majority of users realize that there is nothing random about the way the cards come down. unless you are going to be honest and confess to the way the software is really programmed, get the fuc out!
Dude, it's called copying and pasting from Pokerstars.com. I don't promote the site. I copy and pasted something that no one bothers to read.
So they post security information on their site, they make god knows how much money, but they risk their entire enterprise by committing international fraud and misrepresentation to make a couple measly extra pennies by fixing the cards against you? that's your argument, right?
Majority of users realize that there is nothing random about the way the cards come down? so why don't they use that realization to make money on the pattern? oh wait, they can't, because it's random. oh, but i thought it wasn't random. it's not. so why don't you make money off of it. because they only do it to me sometimes. oooooooh.
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Quote Originally Posted by SOBLATANT:
WE use 249 random bits.WE. why dont you get your online site promoting ass off of here with your bullshit lies about how legit the rigged garbage is. really pisses you off when the majority of users realize that there is nothing random about the way the cards come down. unless you are going to be honest and confess to the way the software is really programmed, get the fuc out!
Dude, it's called copying and pasting from Pokerstars.com. I don't promote the site. I copy and pasted something that no one bothers to read.
So they post security information on their site, they make god knows how much money, but they risk their entire enterprise by committing international fraud and misrepresentation to make a couple measly extra pennies by fixing the cards against you? that's your argument, right?
Majority of users realize that there is nothing random about the way the cards come down? so why don't they use that realization to make money on the pattern? oh wait, they can't, because it's random. oh, but i thought it wasn't random. it's not. so why don't you make money off of it. because they only do it to me sometimes. oooooooh.
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