Poker Players - do you think that poker is beatable longterm?

Yes, poker is a mental drain at times that requires incredible discipline, but the potential big rewards for a small investment make the game so alluring.  And long-term is a very debatable subject, but I would say regarding poker, about 7 years from now, I would like to see where these winning players are.  

Tell me where I go wrong with this theory:

In tournament poker (not cash games, tournament poker only), it is impossible to be a longerm winner.  All "professional" poker players make their money through sponsorship or ownership of poker sites, and the tournament play is a negative on their cash flow statements.  Not one of them would "beat the rake" if they played long enough because you can only get so good at poker, and from there it is a lottery.

Go.

well, this is a great debate.

just fyi i am 24 years old and have been seriously playing poker for about 8 years and betting on sports seriously for 6 years.

first, let me just say that i am a republican, however i believe betting on sports should be legal, and all that oppose it are silly.  we as americans spend more on online gambling(97% of which is spent overseas) than we do on gasoline daily!  the money and jobs created from legalizing and taxing online gaming would damn near get us out of this recession.

i have made this same argument you make about groups of players (A and B theory) for years.  my friends and peers would make fun of me because i told them i would rather play 10 times against phil ivey than 10 times against any random 10 people. this is because first of all, when i sit at the table, i am afraid of no man.  i believe that before i was even legally able to walk into a casino, i could not get any "better" at poker.  now the term "better" can be interpreted different ways.  of course, over time, i have changed my game to adjust to the situation i am in, but in most i stick to my principles and my gameplan reguardless.  and B i believe that the only thing that can give you an advantage over an opponent if the situation is even(chips/bankroll/energy, etc...), is the ability to read him or gain his tells.  this is where the water gets murky and you can make an argument...

i believe that the BEST players in the world, are the ones that can take the entire situation in front of them, and make the best decision over and over again.  now the majority of this comes into play when trying to put a player on a hand.  this is why i believe that daniel negreanu is the best player on earth, over and over again on television and through rumor, this guy has called people's exact two cards and made HUGE laydowns.  so to your argument, some people get better at reading opponents, and some either stay the same or get worse at it.  this is the difference, because yeah, short term, the game involves luck, but over time, the ability to read your opponents will make you a better player.

however, bottom line, in most tournament structures, the blind structures are so retarded, that even if you play perfect for 2 hours, you end up shoving chips in for coin flips and hope for the best, especially in larger tournaments.  there is plenty of money to be made playing poker, just not in tourneys....

SPORTS BETTING IS REAL MONEY, POKER IS FUN...

well, this is a great debate.

just fyi i am 24 years old and have been seriously playing poker for about 8 years and betting on sports seriously for 6 years.

first, let me just say that i am a republican, however i believe betting on sports should be legal, and all that oppose it are silly.  we as americans spend more on online gambling(97% of which is spent overseas) than we do on gasoline daily!  the money and jobs created from legalizing and taxing online gaming would damn near get us out of this recession.

i have made this same argument you make about groups of players (A and B theory) for years.  my friends and peers would make fun of me because i told them i would rather play 10 times against phil ivey than 10 times against any random 10 people. this is because first of all, when i sit at the table, i am afraid of no man.  i believe that before i was even legally able to walk into a casino, i could not get any "better" at poker.  now the term "better" can be interpreted different ways.  of course, over time, i have changed my game to adjust to the situation i am in, but in most i stick to my principles and my gameplan reguardless.  and B i believe that the only thing that can give you an advantage over an opponent if the situation is even(chips/bankroll/energy, etc...), is the ability to read him or gain his tells.  this is where the water gets murky and you can make an argument...

i believe that the BEST players in the world, are the ones that can take the entire situation in front of them, and make the best decision over and over again.  now the majority of this comes into play when trying to put a player on a hand.  this is why i believe that daniel negreanu is the best player on earth, over and over again on television and through rumor, this guy has called people's exact two cards and made HUGE laydowns.  so to your argument, some people get better at reading opponents, and some either stay the same or get worse at it.  this is the difference, because yeah, short term, the game involves luck, but over time, the ability to read your opponents will make you a better player.

however, bottom line, in most tournament structures, the blind structures are so retarded, that even if you play perfect for 2 hours, you end up shoving chips in for coin flips and hope for the best, especially in larger tournaments.  there is plenty of money to be made playing poker, just not in tourneys....

SPORTS BETTING IS REAL MONEY, POKER IS FUN...